New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

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Manuel Cedeno
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New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby Manuel Cedeno » Sat Mar 03, 2018 1:41 pm

This little nugget came out today
https://youtu.be/cQKrMeeTlfc

It's Kamelot. They won't reinvent the wheel but you can expect consistent quality and catchy tunes. In any case I'll be all over this upon release. They are one of the few bands that still bother to play down here in Florida. Will see them live in May.

What do you think?

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby LarryD » Sat Mar 03, 2018 1:51 pm

Just some quick thoughts .......good or bad.........

- It's Haven Part 2
- Tommy stills sounds like Khan; I guess that's the way they want it.
- It's Kamelot.
- It's a bit more industrial sounding, or at least the guitars sound it.
- Sad that only Thom remains of the original lineup.
- It's Kamelot.

I'm in. Let the hating commence.

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Manuel Cedeno » Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:06 pm

LarryD wrote:- It's Haven Part 2

Thom said it goes back to the Ghost Opera days with some Haven in it. We shall see...

LarryD wrote:- Tommy stills sounds like Khan; I guess that's the way they want it.

Sometimes is even creepy how close it gets.

LarryD wrote:- It's a bit more industrial sounding, or at least the guitars sound it.

Yeah. I've been hoping for a departure from that over-produced sound of late. There's not much material to judge here but I do agree that the guitars sound industrial.

LarryD wrote:- Sad that only Thom remains of the original lineup.

Remember when they had bass lines?

LarryD wrote:- It's Kamelot.

It is :)

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Mardoch » Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:19 pm

The issue I have with Tommylot is that they're too cozy in that spot. It's not bad. It's just not different enough from the past to make me care.

But hey, if it works for the business.../shrug.

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby LarryD » Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:39 pm

Mardoch wrote:The issue I have with Tommylot is that they're too cozy in that spot. It's not bad. It's just not different enough from the past to make me care.

But hey, if it works for the business.../shrug.


***I would guess that this is the way that most people might feel at this stage of the game ...... I could be wrong. Kamelot is a machine, and no stopping it. But, it does work as you said ..... maybe the new fan base is starting to overshadow the old fan base, and it keeps on trucking ......... no denying the level of talent in this band, but it does seem to be on repeat mode.

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Nos » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:04 pm

It's already been said; it sounds exactly like Kamelot. All along, I've been more interested to hear Tommy on the upcoming Seventh Wonder album. Shouldn't we be hearing something more about that soon?

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Hearing Aid Man » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:34 pm

Enjoy the last 2, expect the same for the new one.

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby BC » Sun Mar 04, 2018 6:59 pm

Nos wrote:It's already been said; it sounds exactly like Kamelot. All along, I've been more interested to hear Tommy on the upcoming Seventh Wonder album. Shouldn't we be hearing something more about that soon?


We’ll get a single sometime after the new Kamelot is released with the full SW album coming in the fall. The reason? The new Kamelot album. The label doesn’t want the new SW to get lost in the shuffle.
Is a song titled "Everybody Dies" supposed to sound so happy?
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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Man Of Much Metal » Tue Mar 06, 2018 5:59 am

I'm looking forward to hearing the entire album before making a final decision, but I have to say that I might be 'done' with Kamelot. Not for any other reason than their newer material just leaves me a bit 'meh'. I'm not going to join the 'bring back the 'Karma' era, but that was their best period in my personal opinion.
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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby sez » Tue Mar 06, 2018 1:55 pm

Man Of Much Metal wrote:I'm looking forward to hearing the entire album before making a final decision, but I have to say that I might be 'done' with Kamelot. Not for any other reason than their newer material just leaves me a bit 'meh'. I'm not going to join the 'bring back the 'Karma' era, but that was their best period in my personal opinion.


Agreed. Tommy is the only thing bringing me back to Kamelot. I'll probably buy it, but they're going to have to start trying something different to hold my attention in the future.

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Scott B » Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:35 am

At this point, this band has become generic. It sounds like Kamelot. Like every other Kamelot. If you like that, I guess this is something to love. Tommy really hits peak Khan-ness on this track.

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Chris R » Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:16 am

I'm also going to have to.agree here
They have kinda become the AC/DC of symphonic Disney style metal...

If you like it with little change from the previous few albums then this is perfect...
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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby ToddS » Wed Mar 07, 2018 8:00 pm

I don't even feel inspired to listen to this. The last Kamelot recording I enjoyed was The Black Halo. Tommy is one of my favorite singers. An incredible talent. But, I just can't deal with the karaoke Khan.

On top of this, Kamelot is causing a further delay with the SW record? I don't have much love for Kamelot at the moment.

Don't begrudge a man making a living, but I wish Tommy never joined them. All they wanted was a Khan clone anyway. Several of those around that do Khan even better than Tommy.

I'll step off my soapbox now. :)
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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Man Of Much Metal » Fri Apr 06, 2018 3:47 pm

In case anyone is interested, I have penned my review of this new Kamelot album...but my review is a little different to my normal fare & I *may* have gone off on a little rant. But perhaps not for the reasons you may think!

In short, I'm still on the fence with this release thanks to the decisionn-making of their record label, Napalm Records...

https://manofmuchmetal.com/2018/04/05/k ... um-review/

I'd be interested to know what everyone else thinks about the record seeing as how you've already all probably heard it more than I have in the first day of release! :wink:

Cheers,

Matt
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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby introclaus » Fri Apr 06, 2018 7:11 pm

Man Of Much Metal wrote:In case anyone is interested, I have penned my review of this new Kamelot album...but my review is a little different to my normal fare & I *may* have gone off on a little rant. But perhaps not for the reasons you may think!

In short, I'm still on the fence with this release thanks to the decisionn-making of their record label, Napalm Records...

https://manofmuchmetal.com/2018/04/05/k ... um-review/

I'd be interested to know what everyone else thinks about the record seeing as how you've already all probably heard it more than I have in the first day of release! :wink:

Cheers,

Matt


I had the exact same problem as you did with the limited streams - I understand not offering it as download and only as stream, but only providing 5 listens is ridiculous. Either way, it’s their money so they can do what they want. However, what I really love is reading reviews from some people who are “oh my gosh, best/worst Kamelot album - I must have listened to it 20 times...” - ehhh, nope, you haven’t! Lol :)

Anyway, great review as always albeit shorter than normal :)

Here’s what I texted to a friend after having listened to the album a few times:
"The deluxe version of the new KAMELOT album will undoubtedly come in a softly padded velvet box, including a pair of satin gloves to prevent paper-cuts from booklet, as well as a toothbrush and toothpaste to get rid of all the sugar sweetness once done playing the CD. If I didn’t already have diabetes, I undoubtedly would have gotten it today.”

Now, I’ve been listening to the album another 5 times today after receiving the actual album, and my opinion still stands - it’s overly polished and absolutely drained of anything “dangerous”. Even the added blast beats and some growls here and there sounds forced. Sure, it sounds like “Ghost Opera pt 2” musically speaking, but it’s just such a tame version of it. This is like asking for a cup of coffee with 2 pieces of sugar but ending up getting the entire sugar bowl with just a drop of coffee in it - which honestly doesn’t sounds attractive to me! I’m sure there are people out there who like it that way, and good for them, but this is not what I was hoping for.

Will it become an issue for the band that they went this route? Nah, their fan base will buy it anyway (look at me - I bought 3 versions already) this time around - but they really need to start thinking about branching out a bit on the next album if they don’t want to start seeing fans drop off slowly but surely.
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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Nos » Fri Apr 06, 2018 7:58 pm

I got the same promo with the same restrictions, but it doesn't bother me much. I have never had a problem forming an opinion on that many or fewer listens. With as much stuff as is put there, I don't know where I would have the time to listen to everything I review ten times before writing. I couldn't do it.

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby gazinwales » Fri Apr 06, 2018 9:16 pm

It's just another example of a record label being totally out of touch and shooting themselves in the foot.
They seem to forget that the average online reviewer/journalist is unpaid, and promoting their artists for free.
Yet they continue to squeeze them and offer them less and less incentive to have their albums reviewed.

In the old days when i did reviews, you got the odd retail CD/cutout for your efforts or mainly cardboard sleeve promo and that was kind of 'reward' for the review and something you could keep, upgrade and buy the CD or give it away.

Now it seems it could be more hassle than it's worth to stream just 5 plays.

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Manuel Cedeno » Sat Apr 07, 2018 12:04 pm

FIRST IMPRESSIONS
I listened to it once while doing some work and I was bored for the most part. Besides the single everything on the first half felt bland. Then through the second half I remember raising my eyebrows a couple of times; heard some interesting ideas and stuff they hadn't explored before. Did not appreciate the overly filtered safe-industrial guitar sound devoid of crunch. Can't remember a single heavy riff on this thing but that through the in-ear headphones; have to revisit this with my car speakers.

But it's still too early for me. I don't like to judge an album on the first run so this could grow on me. I'll check back after a few spins but I don't have high hopes for this one.

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Re: New Kamelot single

Postby Random Axe » Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:52 pm

I'll just say it, this new one is crap.

Devoid of character or an original thought, Shadow Theory has finally broken me as a fan. Much like the last Circus Maximus, my first and only spin of this album was spent in perpetual WTF face as I tried to process how boring and lifeless this collection of tunes truly is.

Seventh Wonder was pushed back...for this??

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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby LarryD » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:28 am

I edited the title of the post to the above, as the single has now become the disc, and the discussions are on ...... I hope no one minds........

So, here we have the new Kamelot. And the new Vanden Plas. And the new Symphony X. And the new Ayreon. And the new Threshold. And, etc etc ...... These are bands that are at least 20 years old, lots of us have been listening to these bands since day one. And over the years, we've had discussions about each release as they come out - complete with band member changes, singer changes, style changes, etc etc ......and the new Kamelot is nothing new to this concept. They have released yet another disc with pretty much the same formula as they have over the last few discs with Tommy on vocals.....

I was watching an interview with Russell Allen the other day - right around the time when "Underworld" had come out and they were out on tour, and Russ said some things along the same lines of what we are talking about here - they want each SX disc to be different, get new fans, new styles, old styles, etc etc ..... and in that interview I believe he said something to the effect of - " we realize that we may lose some fans along the way, but we can't just put the same disc out over and over " - there are new generations of fans who have never heard of us, and some of those kids are hearing SX for the first time ......yet, we don't want to alienate our old fan base who have been with us since the beginning, it's a tough balance.

I think that pretty much sums up what some of the issues are that bands of 20-year or so age are running into - and Kamelot is no different. In this case, the formula doesn't seem to be changing, since Tommy came on board, and as predicted, lots of fans are starting to bow out, and move on .......and I agree with Russ, and I agree with everyone's thoughts here as well. If you have trouble with the disc, I agree. If you hate the disc, I agree. And so on and so on ........ this is going to happen a lot more as our favorite bands of yesteryear are starting to go through this same thing...... I can also understand the comments about "old school", "dinosaurs", "old style prog", etc as some of the fans move on to the "new" generation of prog metal. And I admire those people.

All that bullshit said (hey, I'm laid up with a fractured ankle, what else do I have to do) - I actually like this disc. Really, it's part 3 of Silverthorn and Haven, and the listener decides which one is better. Looking at it from Mr. Youngblood's point of view, he is the last member of an elite group (hehehe - movie goers know), and his formula with Tommy on board seems to be working. I can't fault him for that. But, the guy knows how to write melodic power metal that just continues to keep me captured, if not only for that reason. We all know it's not Karma, or The Black Halo. But, it's Kamelot in 2018 with a fabulous singer. How long that formula holds out remains to be seen - but it's apparent from what I'm reading around the net, that lots of fans have just about had it with this formula. Really though, what can a band this old do next to keep us all happy ?

Threshold brought back Glynn Morgan - SX went semi-old school and went wild with Underworld - Ayreon finally released a bluray show - all attempts to keep the fire burning ? Or just whatever came next, naturally to them ....... in this case, it's obvious Youngblood's formula is working for him, and the band, and so on it goes.....

Do I want the new Seventh Wonder disc ? Hell yeah ..... I would never say that this new disc of theirs is the shit - and it's the next coming. It's just Kamelot being Kamelot, and I do agree that something new needs to be done because even I'm getting as little frustrated here.... and I'm a dinosaur with the band since day one.....but just because Kamelot looks fancy, puts out cool merch (that I buy), and has great singers, I believe it's time to sit down and re-evaluate this thing......it's not going to be enough to keep on board in the future.....does Kamelot care about fans my age ? Probably not - judging by the crowds they are getting at their shows, and their stage show itself, they seem to be doing just fine. I do fear that this is going to happen to lots of bands this age - like the ones I mentioned above...... what else can a 20-year old band do ?

Vanden Plas needs to write Part 3 of the Chronicles, although I doubt they will.
SX blew us away with some old school tricks with Underworld and went out on their most successful tour ever.
Threshold brought in old school singer, and wrote a concept disc we've all been waiting for.
Ayreon put out that monster bluray show we have wanted for 18 years.
Kamelot just released their 3rd same disc.

Now what ? In the meantime, I'm putting my Shadow Theory disc in the player, and enjoying it for what it is. It's Kamelot. And I like it for what it is.

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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby Harvester » Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:50 am

I'm not sure if it is the pain meds for your ankle, but this is the best post you have written in a while.

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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby LarryD » Sun Apr 08, 2018 11:31 am

Harvester wrote:I'm not sure if it is the pain meds for your ankle, but this is the best post you have written in a while.


*** Thanks bro -- that, and me coming to terms with a lot of things lately ........ music being one of them, and this new Kamelot does seem to be a thought provoking moment for me in musical time ...... Not only that, I'm driving Lynda nuts with my immobility and crankiness, and she wants me to go do something fun...... um, I'm in a wheel chair for God's sake - what would you like me to do ? Answer > go listen to music, or write something .......... done. Now what ? :wink:

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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby introclaus » Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:48 pm

Harvester wrote:I'm not sure if it is the pain meds for your ankle, but this is the best post you have written in a while.


You’re just saying that to be nice. It doesn’t mean he is right though :)

Just kidding - I agree, that was a good post Larry did, even if the album still is pretty “meh” :P
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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby Man Of Much Metal » Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:42 pm

I'm glad I'm not alone with the review issues - I did think long and hard before even writing this review and finally decided to air my issues.

On the album itself, I simply can't decide if I like it or not - I've just not had enough access to it to decide. But from what I did hear, I didn't hate it. I just wasn't blown away & it sounded very familiar. I think the next disc needs to be stellar otherwise I might be close to giving up on modern Kamelot. It's sad to say, but that's where my head is at currently.
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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby Mardoch » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:29 pm

I'm pretty much with Larry on this one. I don't even need to buy it because I know what it is and that I wouldn't listen to it more than once. I'm happy that Youngblood has a solid career in a niche in an industry that doesn't really like to grant them. I'm glad the formula works. But...it's just not for me anymore. There are too many exciting things going on all over the place for me to really want to retreat to "comfort food metal." All that being said I don't have trouble with anyone who happens to love it. There's a lot to love there, especially if you're newish to the genre (or a super diehard for it).

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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby LarryD » Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:34 am

Mardoch wrote:I'm pretty much with Larry on this one. I don't even need to buy it because I know what it is and that I wouldn't listen to it more than once. I'm happy that Youngblood has a solid career in a niche in an industry that doesn't really like to grant them. I'm glad the formula works. But...it's just not for me anymore. There are too many exciting things going on all over the place for me to really want to retreat to "comfort food metal." All that being said I don't have trouble with anyone who happens to love it. There's a lot to love there, especially if you're newish to the genre (or a super diehard for it).


*** I wish I could say what you said in that short amount of time - that sums it up perfectly. I've got time to spare around here, so the long winded route for me passes the time ..... :P But that descriptor above especially about "comfort food metal" is pretty awesome ...... good post Doug.

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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby Chris R » Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:10 pm

Add me to the "meh" group...
Played it through twice today on the road....I was daydreaming and stuff the second go around.
Was hoping something would really grab me and hit repeat(what a really good song does )
Nothing........

Probably a good disk to have on as background music while I'm catching up with edits....
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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby LarryD » Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:55 am

I'm actually enjoying this disc .... is there anyone else out there who is doing the same ? Just curious........

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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby Sir Exar Kun » Thu Apr 12, 2018 12:12 pm

I'm actually enjoying this disc .... is there anyone else out there who is doing the same ? Just curious........


Yeah, I enjoyed it for what it is. I think it has a couple of really good tracks early on that hooked me in. Nothing surprising on the disc, and the singles (honestly) are two of the most generic songs on the disc, so makes for an odd representation to release those out of the gate.
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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby ToddinMN » Thu Apr 12, 2018 1:34 pm

LarryD wrote:I'm actually enjoying this disc .... is there anyone else out there who is doing the same ? Just curious........


I am. Tommy sounds great and there are a handful of really catchy tunes. Not sure how much staying power it will have but for now, it's on repeat.

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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby LarryD » Thu Apr 12, 2018 1:58 pm

ToddinMN wrote:
LarryD wrote:I'm actually enjoying this disc .... is there anyone else out there who is doing the same ? Just curious........


I am. Tommy sounds great and there are a handful of really catchy tunes. Not sure how much staying power it will have but for now, it's on repeat.


****Cool Todd ..... definitely agree with your thoughts ....... same here on the staying power, but for now it's been playing.........

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Re: New Kamelot / The Shadow Theory.....

Postby Hearing Aid Man » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:47 pm

Definitely enjoying the bonus track at the end of disc 2. Worth the $2. Didn't need the instrumental versions though for me to sing along. Maybe it's to audition a new singer when Tommy rejoins SW full time?


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